MTF Thread Highlights

This page is a dedicated archive to threads on the MTF Facebook group that we feel stand out and are worth remembering and reviewing. Keep in mind that only group members can view these threads.

General Discussions

A general bucket of funky threads.

Overview	Thread Starter	Date
Comparing Perlicks, Micromatic, and other rotary style tap systems for highly carbonated beer.	Nathan Rice	03/29/2018
Subthread that contains other links to discussions regarding the attenuation ability of WLP645, and contamination issues in the vials themselves.	Phil Culture	12/29/2016
Andrew Zinn from Wicked Weed gives in depth advice on using WW dregs.	Tracy Mellody	09/07/2016
Fermenting a Brettanomyces beer under 15 PSI versus the same beer in a carboy with no head pressure. Which do you think got funkier?	Devin Henry	07/27/2016
Speculations on what factors effect funky flavors versus fruity flavors in Brettanomyces beers.	DeWayne Schaaf	06/29/2016
Vinnie Cilurzo's barrel racking technique and discussion.	Jay Bakula	03/18/2015
Testing different cooling rates for spontaneous fermentation by cooling in an insulated plastic cooler next to a steel kettle with no insulation. See also Caleb's blog write up.	Caleb Buck	11/24/2015
Do you oxygenate wort for mixed cultures with LAB?	Brandon Jones	11/22/2015

Funky Science Fridays

James Sites might have started Funky Science Friday, but MTF milked it (thanks, James)!

Overview	Thread Starter	Date
Dr. Bryan Heit demonstrates that Lallemand Philly Sour can probably be re-pitched indefinitely if the correct cell count is re-pitched (~0.5-1 million/ml) and it is re-pitched relatively quickly. Oxygenate the wort well, and make the wort very fermentable for better results. See also Dr. Heit's blog post.	Bryan Heit	02/12/2021
A review and discussion of Dr. Maitreya Dunham's research paper on the whole genome sequencing of serially pitched US-05 and the genetic changes over 10 generations, and a family tree of American yeast strains.	Dan Pixley	12/04/2020
Richard Preiss answers questions about his team's published science investigation on how fermentation temperature affects Brettanomyces fermentation.	Richard Preiss	06/07/2019
Kristoffer Krogarus summarizes his published study on finding the gene promoter that explains why some STA1 strains do not ferment starches or dextrins, how this is linked to the Beer 2 yeast group and is not found in wild strains of S. cerevisiae, and new PCR primers for detecting STA1 vs STA1 non-active vs no STA1.	Kristoffer Krogarus	05/31/2019
MTF discusses "The Freshening Power of the Hop" (also known as "Dry Hop Creep"). See also the Hops wiki page.	Mike Lentz	10/05/2018
Reviewing a study that attempts to look at how bacteria affects the evolution of yeast.	Mike Lentz	05/18/2018
Published review of phenols in beer, as well as a discussion on what research we would like to see and why Brettanomyces produces ethyl phenols instead of vinyl phenols.	Mike Lentz	03/19/2018
Exploring some of the science behind beer foam, and how it applies to using chit malt or under modified malt (and the differences between them).	Benedikt Koch	10/11/2017
Overview of a study that showed that 100% Brettanomyces fermentation had more phenol production than when it was co-fermented with the EC1118 wine strain (maybe due to EC1118 being HCDC+), as well as the gene expression difference in EC1118 when co-fermented with B. bruxellensis which made it compete harder for oxygen, and slightly increased the Brettanomyces growth rate in the presence of EC1118. The change in genetic phenotypes of the EC1118 shows that they are involved in interspecies competition between S. cerevisiae and B. bruxellensis.	Richard Preiss	07/26/2017
Lorenzo Peyer's group publishes the first scientific study on kettle souring in a peer-reviewed journal, and discusses it on MTF.	Dan Pixley	06/30/2017
Bryan of Sui Generis blog and Devin Henry, shares their discovery that White Labs WLP648 Brettanomyces bruxellensis Trois Vrai contains two closely related Brettanomyces bruxellensis strains, but have two very different flavor profiles and morphologies.	Bryan	05/12/2017
Results of an experiment at Blue Owl Brewing that analyzed populations of microbes and acid formation in wort soured from different grain sources.	Jeff Young	04/21/2017
A poster presentation of one lab's work to transfer the gene that produces phenols in Brettanomyces to E. coli for the purpose of researching the enzyme (phenolic acid decarboxylase) that produces phenols.	Mike Lentz	03/31/2017
A review of the role of glycerol in sour beer, with a few answers and many questions.	Josh Kauffman	02/17/2017
A look at recent studies that show that lactic acid promotes stuck wine fermentations by altering the genetic phenotype of yeast to ferment multiple classes of sugars at the same time (as opposed to preferring glucose first).	Richard Preiss	12/07/2017
MTF looks at the science behind the claim that StarSan™ (Star San) is not efficient at killing yeast and mold with an expert on microbial cell wall ionic charges.	Dan Pixley	10/14/2016
Sharing Dr. Roy Ventullo's experiment results comparing Samuel Aeschlimann's "Eureka" Lactobacillus starter versus traditional MRS media. Results: similar growth, however the "Eureka" media appears to be healthier for Lactobacillus for a longer period of time.	Dan Pixley	09/23/2016
Scientific research on how thiols from hops create aromatic compounds, and how different strains/species of yeast produce them.	James Sites	08/12/2016
Part 1 and Part 2 of a scientist discussing his findings with Brettanomyces and lactic/acetic acid production: more accurately counting pseudohyphal cells using fluorescence capability of a Cellometer, developing a better way that Titratable Acidity to measure acids using HPLC/UPLC-ELSD (TA measurements can be skewed by the presence of other acids), and an interesting observation that Brettanomyces cultures contaminated with a small cell count of S. cerevisiae responded differently to aeration. By not aerating, the Saccharomyces grew more rapidly and sugar was consumed at a faster rate, and by aerating the Saccharomyces growth was limited which allowed the Brettanomyces to out-compete it (and sugar was consumed at a slower rate).	Brian Martyniak	07/29/2016
Culturing Brettanomyces from 8 vintage Berliner Weisse courtesy of Mike Marcus at Chorlton Brewing Company. Watch for updates.	Richard Preiss	07/15/2016
Mark Trent details his method for isolating Brettanomyces from Saccharomyces from dregs or other mixed cultures.	Mark Trent	07/01/2016
Discussion on a new published study about Brettanomyces evolution based on genome sequencing, vacuole selection that might help Brett survive acidity, and a genetically understood reason for the lack of glycerol production in Brettanomyces.	Richard Preiss	06/17/2016
Discussion with Lorenzo Peyer, a scientist that studies Lactobacillus flavor production in malt-based drinks; primarily discussed the possibility (or lack of) of butyric acid production by Lactobacillus.	Dan Pixley	05/29/2016
Hydroxilation of fatty acids by Lacto and then lactonization of the HSA's by Saccharomyces to produce novel lactone esters.	Dan Pixley	04/29/2016
New scientific data on 100% B. bruxellensis fermentations, including measurements of esters vs phenols, and differences between strains isolated from wines versus those isolated from beer.	Richard Preiss	04/15/2016
Funky Science... Thursday? Link to a new article on Torulaspora delbruekii in beer fermentation, and discussion of the article, including questions about high acetaldehyde amounts and how dangerous that can be to health.	Mike Lentz	03/24/2016
Sensory testing of 6 wild caught B. anomalus strains (verified via RFLP analysis of the 5.8S rDNA/ITS region).	Mike Lentz	01/15/2016
Testing Brettanomyces ester/phenol production based on pitching rate in secondary. See Brettanomyces secondary fermentation experiment for the wiki write up.	Lance Shaner	12/04/2015
Brettanomyces growth experiment measuring aeration and agitation. See Brettanomyces Propagation Experiment for the wiki write up.	Mark Trent	10/23/2015
Richard isolates Brettanomyces and Pichia from an 18 year old gueuze.	Richard Preiss	10/23/2015
Say it with me, Tetrahydropyridine.	Dan Pixley	10/02/2015
Mark Trent's Back To The Future Machine (a custom vessel that is a boil kettle, fermenter, bottling vessel, bright tank, and sterilizer).	Mark Trent	09/04/2015
Advice for growing Lacto on plates.	Mark Trent	09/04/2015
Brett forms a biofilm, which makes it harder to clean.	Mark Trent	08/07/2015
Richard shows us that refrigerated storage of Brett is better than room temperature storage. See Storing Brett for more information.	Richard Preiss	0724/2015
Lance Shaner demonstrates why full attenuation and krausen after pitching only a Lacto culture are signs of yeast contamination.	Lance Shaner	07/21/2015

Microbiology and Science

It's not Funky Science Friday, but it's still pretty geeky.

Overview	Thread Starter	Date
Dr. Bryan Heit finds research that supports the root system of plants (rhizosphere) as being the natural habitat of Brettanomyces, and links to his experiments to isolate Brettanomyces from the root system of plants.	Dr. Bryan Heit	11/02/2022
A project involving many breweries and labs in Brazil to ferment mixed fermentation beer with microorganisms grown from Manipueira, the liquid that comes out of manioc at the time of pressing that is made to produce the manioc flour.	Diego Simão Rzatki	08/06/2022
Discussing urea contained in some yeast nutrient products and in sour beer, and its break down to ethyl carbamate, a known carcinogen.	Dan Pixley/Mark Price	12/03/2021
Q&A on how to hybridize yeast without genetic engineering.	Richard Preiss	12/21/2020
Detailed process for isolating multiple strains of yeast from a mixed culture with the goal of characterizing each individually for a more controlled mixed fermentation.	Ruth Barry	02/23/2020
A light chemistry discussion on why citric acid brightens color in beer, and how much might be required to act as an antioxidant in beer.	Reece Hugill	09/03/2019
Justin Amaral presents his first set of data on analyzing microbial succession in spontaneously fermented beer from Allagash Brewing Co. More data to come from other breweries.	Justin Amaral	06/19/2019
Santeri Tenhovirta shares his Master's Thesis in Food Science from University of Helsinki that examines Lactobacillus wort souring; includes a wide variety of flavor contributions between different species and a lack of significant butyric acid production without purging oxygen.	Santeri Tenhovirta	06/14/2019
Suregork shares his published study on force adapting a lager yeast to produce 60% less diacetyl.	Kristoffer Krogerus	10/11/2018
Discussing the lack of evidence for the claim of microbes developing resistance to sanitizers, as well as comments about the Bells iodophor experiment and the myth that StarSan doesn't kill yeast.	Dan Pixley	07/29/2018
Beachwood Blendery's analysis of Belgian Gueuze and their own sour beers as a tool for reaching a similar acid and flavor profile.	Ryan Fields	07/13/2018
Exploring the idea of whether or not xanthum gum could be broken down by Brettanomyces in such a way that effects of Pediococcus ropiness are replicated.	Colin Burton	05/10/2018
Tracking the temperature of overnight chilling in a coolship, as well as microbes caught during cooling vs originating from barrels.	Walter Danver	02/20/2018
Attempting to collect (hopefully) wort-fermenting microbes at between 30,000 to 65,000 feet in a U2 with NASA pilots.	Steve Haumschild	02/20/2018
A detailed example culturing from a bottle of Cantillon Gueuze 2016, and trialing 3 isolates from it.	Caroline Whalen Taggart	02/05/2018
Comparing flavors from yeast autolysis in wine and beer, and comparing yeast autolysis to reduction flavors in wine, and how those flavors might cross over to sour beer.	Otto Forsberg	12/04/2017
Geneticist Maitreya Dunham shares isolates of a new hybrid species of Pichia and other isolates from Epic Ales sour program.	Rafael Oliveira	07/28/2017
Culturing Brettanomyces from ~40 year old commercial German Berliner Weisse bottles.	Richard Preiss	07/11/2017
Discussion and debate on whether Pediococcus based beers are more "complex" than kettle soured beers, and an informed debate on the science of boiling secondary metabolites and their volatility (see subreplies).	Nèque Bier'd	05/31/2017
Small DIY yeast propagation setup for 60bbl batches of beer, examples of other cheap/DIY yeast propagation systems for small breweries, and challenges of fed-batch culturing explained by Richard Preiss.	Derrick Morse	04/18/2017
Data points on dissolved oxygen in wort that has been cooled over night in a homebrew kettle, with questioning of the reported results by Bryan of Sui Generis based on how much O2 can dissolve in water.	Andres Edward Cruz	03/02/2017
Evidence that shows that WLP099 is a wine strain that does not ferment maltotiose, and that vials contain a second yeast that could be Saccharomyces cerevisiae var diastaticus. See also White labs website.	Kristoffer Krogerus	12/06/2016
Justin Amaral reports his experience with yeasts sent to him by Dr. Matt Bochman at Wild Pitch Yeast: Hanseniaspora vineae, Wickerhamomyces anomalus, and Lachancea fermentati which are believed to produce significant levels of lactic acid. Also Schizosaccharomyces Japonicus. Scroll down for comments by Dr. Bochman himself, as well as skeptical debate of the idea that these species produce significant lactic acid by Bryan of Sui Generis blog.	Justin Amaral	11/02/2016
In depth biology regarding the "myth" that Brettanomyces produces more CO2 per volume of sugar metabolized versus Saccharomyces.	Sean White	10/27/2016
Discussions of the mechanisms of botulism poisoning, and how it applies to different brewing processes.	Moby Toazwith Sandaltann	10/24/2016
Thomas Hübbe uploads his masters thesis on microbes and fermentation in traditional German Berliner Weisse to MTF, along with Q&A.	Thomas Hübbe	09/15/2016
Commentary on the new Verstrepen/White Labs published study on the family tree of yeasts.	Lars Marius Garshol	09/08/2016
Post 1 and Post 2 on a yeast called Lachancea thermotolerans that can produce significant lactic acid without modification. See also this thread on a lab's application to patent pitching this yeast into wort. A follow up post on 09/01/2017 discusses Sheppard and Madden opening a business that claims patent on this yeast, and restricts competing breweries from using it. See also Brewing Science Certificate - University of the Sciences in Philadelphia seeking a patent on another lactic acid yeast, and a discussion on a new patent from this university for a product that is being sold through Lallemand. Update: first rejection for Lachancea LLC attempt to patent using lactic acid yeast in beer fermentation. Update: Bryan Heit disputes the patent claim by University of the Sciences in Philadelphia that the Lallemand Philly Sour is a new species of Lachancea.	Richard Preiss, Devin Henry, Tom Savage, Nick Impelliterri, Bryan Heit	08/04/2016, 08/18/2016, 12/28/2017, 07/08/2020
The L. acetotolerans that contaminated Goose Island's Bourbon County brand beers, including notes from Brett Porter's MBAA presentation on the issue and microbiological information.	Richard Sigesmund	08/04/2016
Lars Marius Garshol sends a collection of samples of Norwegian Kveik from various families to Escarpment Labs for identification, banking, and profiling.	Richard Preiss	06/18/2016
Opinions and discussions on whether fermenting Brettanomyces under pressure, in secondary after a Saccharomyces primary, and other variables play a role in what esters are produced.	Devin Henry	06/01/2016
Technical discussion on the effects of freezing fruit and microorganisms.	David Mast	05/09/2016
Discussion on the difficulty and possibilities of identifying Brettanomyces versus Saccharomyces based on morphology and selective media.	Brian Martyniak	04/30/2016
Data that shows a correction factor of 0.1-0.2° Plato for 0.4-1% lactic acid solutions when using a refactometer.	Jeff Young	04/28/2016
Brettanomyces does not "eat everything," and Nathan Gibbon from Omega Labs shows why by comparing growth on lactose growth media for different species of Brett.	Lance Shaner	04/07/2016
Ehren Schmidt from Toolbox Brewing Co. finds Rhodotorula, a potential pathogen, in fermented beer.	Ehren Schmidt	03/05/2016
Comparing fermentation profile and microbial populations of spontaneously inoculated wort at Black Project Spontaneous & Wild Ales: one starting at 5.9 pH, and one starting at 4.0 pH. Also compared sterile flask fermentation versus barrel fermentation to see how much influence the barrels have. See also Update 1 on 03/15/2016.	James Howat	02/26/2016
Suggestions on getting started with a equipment and procedures for a Quality Assurance/Quality Control program at a brewery.	Stefan Wiswedel	02/18/2016
In depth biology discussion on genetic drift during repitching and when/if it always occurs with comments by Matt Humbard, Richard Preiss, and other scientists.	Lars Marius Garshol	02/03/2016
Sub-thread discussion about yeast and LAB in the guts of bees and wasps, and how to collect it from them.	Matt Spaanem	01/20/2016.
Biology discussion on whether or not Brettanomyces attenuates further when combined with Saccharomyces, and what those mechanics might be (or not be).	Per Buer	01/19/2016
A controlled experiment shows that WLP644 Saccharomyces "Trois" does not form a full pellicle in airlock-fitted flasks stored for 3+ months.	Lance Shaner	01/06/2016
Suregork's cross between Conan yeast and WLP644 Saccharomyces "Trois". Fermentation trials have been promising, showing increased esters and better fermentation performance and attenuation. Kristoffer sent samples out for MTF members to try. See also the results of fermenting an IPA with this yeast by Alex Loijos.	Kristoffer Krogerus	11/06/2016
Mark Trent and Lance Shaner explain why output from traditional yeast pitching rate calculators actually produce up to 4x the amount of cells then what they say they will produce for Brett.	Mark Trent	07/21/2015
Archive of discussions, evaluations, and confirmations of Lance Shaner's discovery that WLP644 Brettanomyces Trois was found genetically to be Saccharomyces cerevisiae.	Dan Pixley	06/27/2015
Best plates for isolating Brett vs Sacch, and growing LAB.	James Howat	08/19/2015
Fermentation and pellicle formation with Hanseniaspora uvarum.	Matt Humbard	08/14/2015
Bryan of Sui Generis Blog educates about Rhodoturula found in Jolly Pumpkin dregs.	Nathan Gibbon	06/26/2015
There's a little more to it than just homoefermentative and heterfermentative LAB.	Dan Pixley	06/09/2015
Bryan of Sui Generis Blog and Matt Humbard agree on why we taste "differences" between Pedio and Lacto driven beers.	Amos Browne	05/14/2015
Discussion on the presence of Brett in the air versus barrels.	Adam Boura	04/14/2015
Bitterness from Brettanomyces.	Dan Pixley	12/07/2015
Can Brettanomyces become airborne?	Asa Dunkerton	07/14/2015

Unique Processes

These processes may or may not make good beer, but they get an A+ for creativity!

Overview	Thread Starter	Date
Niki Georgiev uses Syrah and Merlot grape ale that he brewed to make charcuterie.	Niki Georgiev	05/12/2024
Carbo wine fermented with Tormodgarden kveik (original culture).	Amit Jacob	12/23/2021
Anaerobic curing fresh hops, inspired the curing of cannabis in ethnic communities.	Mike Karnowski	09/12/2021
Exploring the potential of making a non-alcoholic sour beer using a cold extraction mash method ("kalt Auszug" in German).	Ruth Barry	06/07/2020
3D printed lambic/bottle basket.	Kevin Clark	01/12/2020
Experimenting with getting a kveik-fermented raw ale as clear as possible with enzymes and clarifying agents.	Luke Van Oort	10/04/2019
Kräusening traditionally made Berliner Weisse at August Schell to produce faster bottle conditioning and potentially reduced THP.	Jace Marti	09/24/2019
Detailed post on making Makgeolli.	Denise McMahon Rheault	09/01/2019
KOJI BROS. Using koji and rice to ferment dextrins in a coolshipped/mixed fermentation ale with wildflower honey and Japanese seaweed salt.	Jeffrey Airman	04/07/2019
Using a kuurna to filter the mash (tree trunk turned into a lautering system).	Kristian Martin	03/28/2019
Fermenting a 100% Brett blonde ale in bamboo fermenters.	Kyle B Pearce	12/31/2018
Discussing the possibility of using dry ice to limit oxygen exposure during aging; based on a talk by Kevin Martin at Cascade Brewing.	Jared Hevenor	10/28/2018
A weird Halloween experimental brew: racking wort through a "three-tier" pumpkin system with seeds for spontaneous inoculation.	Justin Amaral	10/28/2018
Winemaking technology where acetic acid (volatile acidity) is removed from wine via a membrane filter, and speculating if it could be applied to beer in some way.	Gail Ann Williams	08/26/2018
Exploring the reasons and challenges of serving sour beer flat to the public.	Art Whitaker	08/03/2018
Mixed fermentation (and partial spontaneous fermentation with cooling overnight in a coolship) with meadowsweet and gentian root added to the wort.	Tom Antidoot Jacobs	07/14/2018
Making Peruvian purple corn Chicha using Koji to do the starch conversion, along with some kveik cultures, wild Sacch, Lacto, Pedio, and Pichia.	Justin Amaral	07/10/2018
Making kvass from yams and cherry puree.	Levi Fried	03/26/2018
Experimenting with spontaneous fermentation with a NEIPA recipe and limiting LAB with lysozyme.	Justin Amaral	03/25/2018
Using kveik (and subthreads with Brettanomyces) to make sake.	James Thor	02/06/2018
Experimenting with a large number of split batch meads using lactic acid yeast from Dr. Matt Bochman at Wild Pitch Yeast.	Carolyn Peepall	01/03/2018
Homebrew setup for managing a 25 gallon oak barrel and a Speidal fermenter modified with a thermal well, an internal chiller, and a spill containment pallet, all racked with gravity.	Aaron Ritchie	11/8/2017
Alex Seitz from VonSeitz Theoreticales explains the amphora building process, and discusses a gruit made with Mud King and amaranth. See also this MTF thread by Ed Coffee and this MTF thread by Kenny Carlsson.	Art Whitaker	10/29/2017
One brewer's detailed experience with Méthode Champenoise in a blended beer with Brettanomyces as inspired by Ben Howe of Enlightenment Ales. See also Brew Files - Episode 22 - Call Out The Brut Squad.	Sean Towers	10/18/2017
Tips on preventing fruit flies during open fermentation for commercial brewers.	John Parks	10/09/2017
Using northern climate wine grapes (Frontenac, Frontenac gris, etc.) in beer along with malolactic fermentation with O. oeni or other lactic acid bacteria.	Todd Weaver	09/12/2017
Wild fermented perry that tastes like a Flanders Red, with a natural unfermentable sugar sorbitol that is produced naturally from pears.	Tariq Ahmed	09/10/2017
Example and discussion on how to use malt extract to make great sour beers. All grain schmall grain. Beginner Q&A as well.	Devin Bell	08/20/2017
A Belgian lambic blender inquires about ethyl acetate and acetic acid formation during fruit maceration, and using a punchdown to resolve any issues.	Raf Soef	08/07/2017
Discussing not purging with CO2 for kettle sours with commercial brewers: the reasons, speculations, myths, and experiences on to do it or not do it.	Dan Pixley	08/04/2017
A homebrewer with 110 gallons of sour/Brett beer split across 22 carboys details his experience with THP, acetic acid, and blending.	Robert Neuhaus	07/22/2017
Gluten free sour brewing, along with Amoretti flavorings.	Joe Morris	07/02/2017
Discussions on how colder temperatures affect Brettanomyces fermentation, including historical perspectives on one ~100 year old Czech beer that had Brettanomyces and acetic acid in it.	Dave Janssen	06/12/2017
Experiences using hay/straw/hulls/hops during mashing, and historical references to this process.	Dave Janssen	04/24/2017
Primitive Beer Project up in woodlands near Nymans Sussex. Day 1: tapping birch trees for sap, smoking 2kg malt with sweet chestnut. Day 2: collecting juniper, Brewing the beer with stream water collected and filtered on site as well as birch sap, fire fueled by wood from site, wort cooled down by stream water.	James Thor	03/25/2017
Experimenting with funky cider in a traditional multi-vessel solera system, along with tips on blending funky/sour cider and dealing with malolactic fermentation.	Tariq Ahmed	03/13/2017
A possible answer to the mysterious NHC 2016 (first round at Nashville) "Green Sour Beer".	Dean Volungis	01/24/2017
Testing lactic acid producing yeasts sourced by Dr. Matt Bochman Hanseniaspora vineae, Wickerhamomyces anomalus, and Lachancea fermentati, along with Schizosaccharomyces Japonicus.	Justin Amaral	11/02/2016
Council Brewing Co's Jeff Crane reports on spontaneously fermenting wort using apple pomace as the only inoculate.	Jeff Crane	09/14/2016
Barrel fermented porter with 100 lbs of Cabernet Sauvignon grapes with stems, fermented with red wine yeast (BM45) and B. bruxellensis. More tips for using Brett in wine from Dara here.	Dara McMains	08/31/2016
Beer fermented with a Vietnamese culture called "Con me" which translates loosely to "mother" that usually contains LAB and Nematodes.	Mark Trent	07/27/2016
Aging Brettanomyces beer (bottled with corks) in a cheese cave to absorb the aroma of the cheese.	Mark Trent	07/12/2016
Positive results of MLF using O. oeni in mixed fermentation cider, as well as questions and answers with an award winning mixed fermentation cider maker.	Tariq Ahmed	07/11/2016
Homebrewing a beer inspired by traditional brewing methods of Norwegian farmhouse ales using Voss Kveik, along with tips on how to forage for juniper (Juniperus communis).	James Thor	06/18/2016
The effects of using sugar in Brett saisons, and how that effects mouthfeel and dryness, as well as discussions on how water chemistry and hops come into play.	Josh Kauffman	06/13/2016
Using a spontaneous culture from Rubio tequila factory in Tequila, Mexico to ferment a blond ale with agave syrup.	Alex Loijos	06/11/2016
DeWayne Schaaf's journey into bioprospecting and fermenting wine juice with wild caught yeast and bacteria.	DeWayne Shaaf	06/06/2016
Hilton Meyer tracks down potter Daniel Toberer who makes amphora and provides tips to make them with photos.	Hilton Meyer	04/24/2016
Experiences drying and storing yeast on paper or wood with references to historical preservation of Kveik yeast. Also see Kveik.	Per Buer	04/07/2016
Q&A about species of juniper to use for Norwegian farmhouse ales, as well as other types of trees/branches.	Mike Karnowski	03/14/2016
"Reverse MTF Souring." Devin Bell's experience with co-pitching probiotic L. plantarum with yeast, or pitching it after primary fermentation, and still getting sourness. Also demonstrates a very easy extract sour recipe/method for beginners.	Devin Bell	01/20/2016
Sun dried wild yeast (might be Kluyveromyces?) from the Republic of Benin in West Africa used to ferment sorghum beers.	Ingo Janssen	01/14/2016
Discussion of historic approaches to Belgian Wits - Short/no boils, very fast turnaround, etc.	Amos Browne	12/28/2015
Continuous inoculation of wort with a developing sauerkraut culture.	Alex Loijos	11/29/2015
100% malted sorghum Berliner Weisse.	Joel Piazza	12/02/2015
Runoff through a channel in a pine tree into a barrel used as a coolship.	Michael Detar	11/20/2015
Open fermentation in a barrel with a house culture of English yeast and B. claussenii using top cropping techniques.	Joel Stickrod	10/06/2015
100% fermented B. claussenii wine from Malvasia, Petite Manseng and Viognier grapes.	Dara McMains	09/12/2015
4 day open fermentation with Trois and Claussenii.	John Yorger	02/10/2015
The birth of using probiotics to make sour beer on MTF by Josh Osborne and Devin Bell.	Josh Osborne	01/03/2015

Beer History and Culture

Research and thoughts on how beer was made back in the day, as well as cultural alcoholic mixed fermentation.

Overview	Thread Starter	Date
Commentary sparked by Alex Kidd aka 'Dontdrinkbeers' on the current state of commercial American Wild Ales.	Dan Pixley	12/28/2024
A discussion about Raf Meert's new book that argues for a more historically based narrative for lambic and gueuze, "Lambic - The Untamed Brussels Beer Origin, Evolution, and Future".	Dan Pixley	01/14/2023
A passage from "The Principles and Practice of Brewing," Sykes, 1907, which explains that a combination of dry hop creep and Brettanomyces are responsible for preserving high carbonation in wooden casks.	Gareth Young	06/18/2021
Write up of the fermentation process for traditional Jamaican rum, with an emphasis on aromatic mold (Thielaviopsis ethacetica) and Schizosaccharomyces pombe.	Cory Widmayer	03/20/2020
Benedikt Koch and Samuel Aeschlimann of Eureka Brewing blog and Blackwell Brewing in Switzerland make a traditionally inspired gose that is 100% floor-malted wheat, lautered with straw, boiled for 2 hours, and spontaneously fermented.	Benedikt Koch	01/11/2020
The story of a Norwegian reviving his father-in-law's farm and traditional brewhouse, and his journey in learning how to brew farmhouse ales the traditional way.	Ivar A. Geithung	01/31/2019
Recreating Mavi (sometimes Mabi) from the Caribbean with a few modern twists.	Connor Harron	01/08/2019
Insights into an article about an old Lithuanian brewer who is hesitant to share her yeast, risking the disappearance of a dying farmhouse brewing tradition.	João Pedro Fernandes	08/30/2018
Brewing indigenous alcoholic beverages from South Korea, such as Yeonyeop-ju and Makgeolli using native cultures from the region that include Koji, Pichia, and other microbes.	Justin Amaral	08/27/2018
Follow up post from the Milk The Funk "The Podcast" interview with Benedikt Koch about traditional German Berliner Weisse with contributions from Ron Smith on experiencing the accurate historical versions from Schneeeule Brauerei, as well as accumulated data on ester/acid profiles from traditional Berliner Weisse versus kettle soured Berliner Weisse and Belgian gueuze by Benedikt.	Art Whitaker	08/21/2018
Discussing the history of fermenting wild grown grapes in North America.	Eirik Storesund	08/14/2018
Alex Robertson wonders if anyone else uses a L. plantarum strain that he had found and banked banked at Omega Yeast Labs; something now called "OYL-605 Lacto Blend". Anyone ever heard of that culture?	Alex Robertson	07/07/2018
Discussing a study, "Brewing Technique of Mbege, a Banana Beer Produced in Northeastern Tanzania".	Kristen England	06/01/2018
Brettanomyces strain selection for recreating late 1700's/early 1800's British porter with the assistance of Ron Pattenson.	Mike Karnowski	05/16/2018
Documenting the process of a partially spontaneously fermented sorghum and millet beer that originated in Benin, West Africa.	Ryan Deaver	02/05/2018
Hors Catégorie Brewing's post on early 20th/late 19th century saison which discusses ingredients and brewing process; MTF thread includes comments about sourcing historically representative 6-row malt and explores the evidence for some historical saisons being sour.	Dave Janssen	01/08/2018
Overview of the 2017 NORSK Kornølfestival in Norway, a festival dedicated to Norwegian farmhouse brewing, and how conventional modern brewing is ignored in favor of historical process.	Richard Preiss and Ehren Schmidt	10/02/2017
Richard's analysis of traditional farmhouse yeast from Chuvashia, Russia. The samples were gathered by Lars Marius Garshol from the Rima family.	Richard Preiss	08/24/2017
MTF Tepache thread with links to other tepache threads.	Chase Healey	08/20/2017
Blog post discussion on Blanche de Cambrai (historical Northern France white beer), and comparisons to historical Berliner Weisse brewing. See also Dave Jassen's direct blog post on Hors Categorie blog. Also, see Mike Lentz recreate the cold water grain pre-rinse to reduce color technique that was historically used in this beer style.	Dave Janssen	07/24/2017
Traditional Thai Sahto (fermented rice wine) and the distilled version Lao Khao, fermented with balls of dried yeast.	Stefan Wiswedel	05/13/2017
Write up and links to information about "Chhang", a barley-based fermented beverage made all around Tibet and the Himalayas. This version is made in Ladakhi.	Alex Loijos	04/09/2017
Tips on brewing Lichtenhainer from Kristen England and others.	Stephen Knapp	04/06/2017
Exploring spontaneously fermented banana and coconut water wine on the island of Rarotonga in the Cook Islands.	Ehren Schmidt	03/07/2017
Discussion on Belgian Wits historically being very young spontaneously fermented beer, with links from Yvan de Baets, references to "Brewing With Wheat", Ron Pattinson references, and a link to Mike Karnowski's recreation of such a beer.	Levi Fried	01/25/2017
English translation of several 1800's texts about how Gose was made by forming a "thick layer of mold" on top, and bottled in longneck bottles so that the yeast pellicle would dry out to trap the CO2 instead of using corks. Also information about gravities during fermentation, lactic acid content, salt content, and alcohol content.	Benedikt Koch	01/17/2017
Tony Yates in Norway videos brewing a traditional Norwegian farmhouse ale, and splits the batch with several kveik yeasts: Stig Staljen (Hornindal), Arve Espe Espa (Hornindal), John Nornes (Voss), Sigmund Gjernes (Voss) and Bjarne Mur (Olden).	Dan Pixley	12/26/2016
Translation of a text from A. Dörfel written in 1947 about the creation of Berliner Weisse (process portion only).	Benedikt Koch	12/31/2016
A kveik ring from Vågå, Norway that hasn't been used since WWII, and attempts to culture yeast from it.	William Holden	12/10/2016
Discussing a YouTube video of Finnish brewers brewing a traditional Sahti, including translation of the process portions by Teemu Halonen.	Devin Bell	12/8/2016
Ryan Deaver's detailed report on the local/indigenous fermentationists in Benin, West /Africa, complete with images and descriptions of their fermentation processes. The first installment is about spontaneously fermented Palm Wine and the distilled version, Sodabe. See also Ryan interviewed by James Spencer on BasicBrewing Radio (02/02/2017).	Ryan Deaver	11/08/2016
MTF tracks down Mike Matucheski, currently a master cheesemaker at Sartori, who was a homebrewer who barrel fermented wild ale in the late 80's and early 90's in the USA before most people could taste commercial examples from Belgium. See also the MTF Live interview with Mike five years later.	Dan Pixley	09/11/2016
Dave Janssen's research on historical "Northern French white beers" from circa 1900.	Dave Janssen	07/25/2016
The invasion of ancient Norwegian yeast. See Kveik for more information.	Lars Marius Garshol	03/21/2015

Brewing Philosophy Discussions

Informed, controversial, opinionated, discussions on sour and funky brewing processes and industry.

Overview	Thread Starter	Date
Speculating about the anecdotes of perceived decreases in packaged sour beer over time (see comments by Richard Preiss).	Danny Tindall	07/10/2021
The decline of mixed fermentation and barrel aged sour beers in sales compared to kettle sours and other styles of beer in the US market.	Mike Karnowski	01/07/2020
Has kveik hit the Trough of Disillusionment?	Alex Levy	11/01/2019
Articulating the definition of the words "landrace yeast", as is used on the wiki to describe kveik and other traditional farmhouse cultures.	Dan Pixley	11/28/2018
Articulating the definition of the words "domesticated" and "wild" when it comes to yeast.	Matt Spaanem	11/23/2018
The difference between "coolships" and "open fermenters", and discussing commercial breweries that conflate the two.	Bob Sylvester	09/10/2018
The quest to find 500 mL cork and cage bottles, and discussing the industry trend of moving away from 750 mL bottle formats (also a good subthread on canning).	Mike Karnowski	08/29/2018
Discussing a GBH article on the recent craft brewing trend of adding juice to kettle sours (and other non-pasteuried beer) without re-fermentation, and the resulting exploding cans.	Dan Pixley	08/23/2018
Discussing the BJCP's decision to include the Catharina Sour as a new style.	Mark Price	07/07/2018
When is it appropriate to use the word "terrior" in beer brewing, if at all?	Jeffrey Young	05/23/2018
Discussing the White Labs lawsuit by Left Hand, and methods for identifying Saccharomyces cerevisiae var. diastaticus.	Joe Wells	11/18/2017
General topic of health related issues with wild brewing, and government regulation that might be coming.	DeWayne Schaaf	11/17/2017
Ozone vs steam/boiling water for sanitizing barrels and breweries with a very detailed comparison of the two approaches from Nate Ferguson of Escarpment Labs.	Andrew Zinn	10/24/2017
Information and debates on different vessel types for aging beer on fruit for commercial brewers. (also linked on the IBC Tote wikipage).	Dan Pixley	07/26/2017
Exploring the role that water chemistry plays in saisons, wild beers, and sours.	Garrett Hoepker	07/28/2017
Bryan of Sui Generis Blog schools us on how Lactobacillus protease works to reduce head retention proteins, techniques to prevent this, and counters certain claims about long cold lactic fermentation to maintain head forming proteins (the original poster removed his comments, so some context is missing, but Bryan's information is worth saving).	Bryan	06/12/2017
Who here does dirty and clean beers on the same gear in a commercial brewery (and lots of advice on cleaning/sanitizing on a commercial brewery level when brewing sours along side clean beers)?	Wilf Horsfall	06/05/2017
MTF helps Josh identify the owner of and take action against a fake website pretending to sell oak barrels to rip people off.	Josh Kauffman	01/16/2017
Discussing the idea of birthing a style, "Cervino", a spontaneous blend of wort of wine must.	Levi Funk	11/15/2016
MTF'ers share their methods of building a mixed culture.	Sean McVeigh	08/25/2016
Experiences on how different bottles of 88% lactic acid from the same manufacturer taste differently in tasting panels, and some potential explanations from chemist Mike Castagno.	Ron Smith	08/17/2016
Example of GM yeast that glows in the dark, and discussions of GM and intellectual property of resulting microorganisms. See also this subthread with yeast experts on the use of IP on yeast strains.	Nick Moench	07/11/2016
Discussing the mechanics of gushing and what causes gushing in sour beers.	Kyle McHerron	06/30/2016
Questions answered regarding what category to enter fruited Gose or fruited Berliner Weisse into for BJCP competitions, with advise from Gordon Strong.	Andrew Grumke	04/05/2016
General advise and approaches to making "quick turn around" mixed fermentation sours (1-3 months).	James Thor	03/24/2016
Questions and answers on contracting wort production from another brewery for a sour brewery. Answers from brewers, including Jeff Porn and Levi Funk.	Rion Spurlock	02/29/2016
Discussion on how much coolships might influence Belgian Lambic versus barrels with scientific studies discussed, and insights from Pierre Tilquin and James Howat.	Ron Smith	01/29/2016
Discussion on Jester King's new coolship, discussing supplementing spontaneously inoculated wort with pure cultures versus 100% spontaneously fermented beer with comments by James Howat, James Sites, and Garrett Crowell.	Mark B. Fry	01/12/2016
Discussion on the new trend towards green bottles, which devolved into a discussion of saison/farmhouse beer history with Lars Garshol. See also this thread started by Jeff Porn on the recent trend of using green bottles and this thread by Tristan Stewart on purposeful bulk sun-striking. See also this thread by Bob Sylvester on a direct reference to Saison Dupont's take on green bottles.	James Howat	12/04/2015
Discussion on whether or not Lambic has to be brewed in Belgium in order to be called "Lambic".	Devin Bell	02/06/2015
Discussion of why some brewers warn against kettle souring.	Wayne Wambles	05/11/2015
Discussion of what inspires us to brew funky/mixed fermentation beers.	James Sites	11/19/2015
A microbiologist view on why using dregs is non-ideal.	Tamir Danon	10/08/2015
Discussion of lactic acid production with Bryan of Sui Generis Blog and Matt Humbard, as well as why you shouldn't use WLP677 and the beginning discussions of why Lacto can't fully attenuate wort on its own. Also the source of the great Lance Shaner quote, "Agree that maths are hard."	Lyall Anderson	05/06/2015
Warning against using plastic containers as coolships from a polymer chemist, and coolship dimension philosophies from James Howat and Kristen England (read all of the sub-replies).	Dave Stokley	11/12/2015
Discussion on whether or not some 100% Brett fermentations that perform like Sacch fermentations actually contain cross contamination of Sacch yeast.	Lance Shaner	08/12/2015
Discussion of the use of the term saison (read all of the sub-replies). See also this similar discussion from the Saison, Biere de Garde & Farmhouse Ale group.	Bob Sylvester	12/28/2015

MTF Community

Posts that make us proud to be a part of the MTF community. See also MTF Community Projects.

Overview	Thread Starter	Date
A spreadsheet for commercial brewers to offer non-exempt TTB ingredients for which they have gotten approval for to help other brewers get TTB approval for the same ingredient in beer (this only applies to USA commercial brewers).	Michael Thorpe	08/22/2018
Tristan Stewart opens his brewery, Temporal Artisan Ales, and shares thanks to MTF and details his operation.	Tristan Stewart	02/07/2018
Brendan Palfreyman helps "Milk The Funk" become a registered trademark.	Devin Bell	01/13/2017
Bootleg Biology collects dregs from homebrewers at the Milk The Funk Meetup and Bottle Share at HomebrewCon 2016, and offers the mixed culture as a one time only deal to MTF'ers!	Jeff Mello	06/22/2016
Cassie from GoodBelly drops by to say hello to MTF members, and asks for recipes for their blog.	Cassie At GoodBelly	04/08/2016

See Also

Additional Articles on MTF Wiki

• Sour Brewing FAQ

External Resources

• Milk The Funk Facebook Group